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Ąžuolas Tubelis thread

  • Thread starter Thread starter Straight forward2
  • Start date Start date
Tubelis officially landed on USA soil! Dropped 31pts, only second freshman to do it under Miller (first is Deandre Ayton). Lately he's balling and now exceeding Domas Sabonis freshman season numbers. Wildcats is guards team, three guards are their main guys, but now Tubelis establishing himself as potentially the best on the team, playing around thirty minutes each game. I expected something like that scoring wise even earlier, but his development has been incredible. I mean how he sets the screens, how he post ups, cleans the way and stuff, he wasn't doing that stuff in NKL, so greeting to great coaching of Wildcats staff:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=deUbsU6LHdc
 
Tubelis reaches certain consistency already. He's in double figures last 5 games. It's great that he actually shoots threes here and there with a good accuracy thus far. In comparison, Sabonis didn't shot a single three in his freshman season.

Here's the race between Domas, Kleiza and Azualas stats wise thus far (all 18yo freshmen):

Tubelis 22.7min, 11,2pts(49.5/42.9), 6rbs
Sabonis 21,6min, 9,7pts(66/0), 7.1rbs
Kleiza 23.1min, 11,1pts(44/45), 8,5rbs

Here explicit 5min highs (both O and D) of his best game:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=orLrQjgYbx0
 
And LOL on James Akinjo. He threw up a crazy three instead of looking to open Tubelis :o The guy has terrible body language, barely shakes hands when other scores. Typical selfish American PG who shoots 36.0 from the field. That's the worse part of Tubelis campaign in Arisona, because I think Akinjo guy (main PG of Arisona) is a cunt, at least now, maybe will grow up.
 
Akinjo had to leave the Georgetown program because of his undisciplined behavior. He is a selfish player but also a borderline draftee
 
madmax said:
and some lithuanian posters have a nerve to exclude this wonder kid from our NT this upcoming summer lol - he's the most talented player I've seen in a long time from our tiny country and we should be including him with the mens programme already:cool:
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Well, he's on the same path as Kleiza was as 18yo in NCAA. And Kleiza made NT as 21yo in 2006 WC. And even at 21, even if he did well scoring wise, he was still wild player, jacking off threes 22,2perc. OK, Sabonis made NT as 19yo, but he was tourist in not so deep 2015 EB team. Now we have Domas Sabonis, Sedekerskis at 4 and some Bendzius/Maciulis...I'm fine if Tubelis snatches that third PF position, but I doubt it's gonna happen.
 
Tubelis 16/12 tonight. Statistically he's on his way to become best Lith freshman ever. Watched some highs, and it's certainly unique how tough he is and how explosively he can run with such body. He might be even tougher than Domas eventually and Domas is incredible bully for his size. Off course, Tubelis doesn't have an upside as Sabonis, because Sabonis is more skilled and crafty and he's borderline superstar in the League now, but Tubelis will have a good chances to achieve more than Kleiza achieved in the NBA, IMO.

I was wondering for a moment who would I prefer, Tubelis or Kleiza as prospects for the NT...and I came up with conclusion that now it's Tubelis. Prime Kleiza was super spot on for the 2010 team when everything was around him offensively (NT lacked quality already and there was no other elite players around). But now, how I project at least, we are building deep and elite NT again, and Tubelis with his D presence, ball movement and higher basketball IQ will be a better fit for 20's NT than Kleiza would be with his scoring mentality and crappy D/system ball. If that would be 10's, Tubelis wouldn't make such sense because he doesn't have a skillset to be No.1 option as Kleiza had, but if it's an elite team already, I take another strong piece to enforce and not to screw the core with 2 ways, system baller as Tubelis. Tubelis at 5, Sedekerskis at 4 and Marciulionis at 1 might make the most mortal defensive lineup we ever had. I don't recall NT line up with three elite defensive players and now it might become a reality.
 
Heh, SF, of course you'll always prefer a prospect :) I'd be really surprised if you'd say - Kleiza. But if you talk about NT, you found not really a right comparison here IMO. You could go with some Songaila instead maybe. Kleiza is type of player that was perfect for international game when he moved to PF, also he matured big time after that season with Oly, became real go-to guy. We had only few such scoring machines in our bball history, a guys who could score ~20ppg in tournaments. Before injury Kleiza became one of these. Even in 2012 he still looked decent, but sadly we had too long summer for him to stay in top shape and injured knee started to bother. Maybe Tubelis will be really good some day, but so far he is unproven player in senior bball. He deserves a chance like the same Songaila got back in 2000, at least invitation to summer camps and maybe he will surprise us, but I'd definitely go with another Kleiza for next decade, especially for the most problematic position in NT
 
From what im seeing Tubelis will be center too .Most of his points comes in paint.I see him also way closer to Songaila PF-C type.

Kleiza was more SF-PF. Tubelis is PF-C.

Kleiza was other planet offensively he was scoring from everywhere.Kleiza at 18 played in worlds u-19 champ 2003 and was leading entire tournament with 29,1pts average and led to silver medal our youth team.Only TV or internet back then wasnt showing those youth tournaments.Second leading scorer in ltu team was Jankunas with 12,1pts :)


Ncaa is diffrent league alot younger and most best players goes to nba after 1 year,nobody stays for 3-4 as used to be even 15-20 years ago.When Duncans used to play in ncaa till 21,now Zions plays there only till 19 .

best Ncaa players used to be 21-22 old age ,now is more that best players are around 19 age most tallented freshmans.

best defensive trio in NT my mind came up with this one:

in 2013 NT had peak Seibutis,peak Maciulis and young Dmo at C that was moving his feet with best guards i would say elite 3 men defence Kazlauskas was putting there in some streaches.

That lineup shut down crazy and unpredictable italian offence in 2 half of crusial 1/4 playoofs game. To this day that was best dmo game in nt.

In 2021 its hard for NT to put defensive trios when nobody plays good defence from backourt players.
 
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Mindozas said:
Heh, SF, of course you'll always prefer a prospect :) I'd be really surprised if you'd say - Kleiza. But if you talk about NT, you found not really a right comparison here IMO. You could go with some Songaila instead maybe. Kleiza is type of player that was perfect for international game when he moved to PF, also he matured big time after that season with Oly, became real go-to guy. We had only few such scoring machines in our bball history, a guys who could score ~20ppg in tournaments. Before injury Kleiza became one of these. Even in 2012 he still looked decent, but sadly we had too long summer for him to stay in top shape and injured knee started to bother. Maybe Tubelis will be really good some day, but so far he is unproven player in senior bball. He deserves a chance like the same Songaila got back in 2000, at least invitation to summer camps and maybe he will surprise us, but I'd definitely go with another Kleiza for next decade, especially for the most problematic position in NT
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I meant, what would I choose between 18yo Kleiza and 18yo Tubelis looking forward to 20's NT. It's tricky and I expected opposition here, it's other side of the coin really. But my point was that Kleiza's 20pts might be outweighed by Tubelis elite defence (I should emphasize that most of our elite bigs weren't elite defenders...even Arvydas who was too slow to be treated elite, IMO), superior passing and still very good offense, some 12/16ppg in FIBA, IMO. I mean, sure, you still want to have a guy who can give you buckets at elite level. But I also remember such teams as Russia 2007. They had Kirilenko and Khriapa (couple of other strong defenders) and that Russia locked more offensively talented teams as Lithuania, Spain and grabbed the title. That's why I'm having a hard time choosing between Kleiza and Tubelis. We might potentially have something very reliable with Tubelis, Sedekerskis, Marciulionis on the court because of their limitless defensive upside (not to mention that players like Velicka, Jokubaitis, Sirvydis, D. Giedraitis should make their defensive impact as well). I think that three elite players in one lineup might be unprecedented and I'm willing to see what will be the outcome.

Comparison with Songaila is interesting, but tricky. Pakėnas guy described Tubelis as antithesis to Songaila, and Pakėnas obviously exaggerated rather strongly, but Tubelis is more athletic. Tubelis still has more explosive first step, is a better leaper, way faster in the open court and can put the ball on the flour as Songaila never could. On other hand, Songaila had more reliable jump shot. Both were reliable defenders, but I still treat Tubelis more complete defender cause he can live with 2/5 positions because of his agility and Tubelis has quicker and more explosive hands. While to me Songaila was a boderline elite forward, I treat Tubelis as elite (yet prospect) forward who should have some 14/16pts, 8/10rbs, 3as NBA seasons, being a started at least for a couple of seasons in his prime. That's my projection. We'll see if I'll be spot on with it.

Have in mind that 18yo Tubelis nearly matches 20yo Songaila's NCAA stats (Songaila was a freshman in NCAA being 20yo). And Songaila made NT being 22yo, while we speculate that 19yo Tubelis potentially might be in the camp this summer and maybe would even make it if he continues to develop big time.
 
Shawshank said:
best Ncaa players used to be 21-22 old age ,now is more that best players are around 19 age most tallented freshmans.
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It's simple. The younger you are as a prospect going to the drafts, the more credit you get. There's rather substantial difference even between 19 and 20. The same Jokubaitis talked about it.
 
Shawshank said:
in 2013 NT had peak Seibutis,peak Maciulis and young Dmo at C that was moving his feet with best guards i would say elite 3 men defence Kazlauskas was putting there in some streaches.
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Interesting shot. That's a good one. In 2015 we can also name Seibutis, Maciulis, Jankunas as well.

Other than that, I think say Sabonis, Marciulionis, Chomicius in 1992 (even though, now I would have to watch Chomicius closely again, he was on his decline). And surely Songaila, M.Zukauskas, Siskauskas in the golden season. Those provided modern and strong defensive punch, Sireika at that time already was very modern switching everything at times.
 
Straight forward said:
I meant, what would I choose between 18yo Kleiza and 18yo Tubelis looking forward to 20's NT. It's tricky and I expected opposition here, it's other side of the coin really. But my point was that Kleiza's 20pts might be outweighed by Tubelis elite defence (I should emphasize that most of our elite bigs weren't elite defenders...even Arvydas who was too slow to be treated elite, IMO), superior passing and still very good offense, some 12/16ppg in FIBA, IMO. I mean, sure, you still want to have a guy who can give you buckets at elite level. But I also remember such teams as Russia 2007. They had Kirilenko and Khriapa (couple of other strong defenders) and that Russia locked more offensively talented teams as Lithuania, Spain and grabbed the title. That's why I'm having a hard time choosing between Kleiza and Tubelis. We might potentially have something very reliable with Tubelis, Sedekerskis, Marciulionis on the court because of their limitless defensive upside (not to mention that players like Velicka, Jokubaitis, Sirvydis, D. Giedraitis should make their defensive impact as well). I think that three elite players in one lineup might be unprecedented and I'm willing to see what will be the outcome.
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I get you idea. I was basically saying that we already know what Kleiza had become, so it's hard to look at him only as 18yo prospect, even tho back in the day he was hell of the talent, he even played as C in some youth tournaments, cause was very strong physically. He was more versatile, better scorer, better leader, watching him you could feel that this guy will be big, he had all the package with talent and character. Tubelis is talented, but so far everything is on paper. We can't really say that he will bring elite defense to senior level. I hope he will and of course you need a player like that, but I wouldn't put him in the same category as Kleiza yet or the same Kirilenko, latter was a player who could cover almost every position, huge IQ, amazing versatility. That Russia was loaded and we lost against them in 2007 not cause of elite individual defense, but cause we were simply unprepared, we had no day off, when Russia did and Butautas simply didn't have a plan. Blatt just kicked out our asses early and we had to waste tons of energy to catch up, but at the end collapsed. In 2008 we beat them. I'm not taking anything away from Tubelis, he is surely talented kid, but yet I don't feel that superstar material, but maybe that's just me. I simply think it's a bit too early to judge. We need some proves on senior level, I hope he will give us some clues upcoming summer

Straight forward said:
Comparison with Songaila is interesting, but tricky. Pakėnas guy described Tubelis as antithesis to Songaila, and Pakėnas obviously exaggerated rather strongly, but Tubelis is more athletic. Tubelis still has more explosive first step, is a better leaper, way faster in the open court and can put the ball on the flour as Songaila never could. On other hand, Songaila had more reliable jump shot. Both were reliable defenders, but I still treat Tubelis more complete defender cause he can live with 2/5 positions because of his agility and Tubelis has quicker and more explosive hands. While to me Songaila was a boderline elite forward, I treat Tubelis as elite (yet prospect) forward who should have some 14/16pts, 8/10rbs, 3as NBA seasons, being a started at least for a couple of seasons in his prime. That's my projection. We'll see if I'll be spot on with it.

Have in mind that 18yo Tubelis nearly matches 20yo Songaila's NCAA stats (Songaila was a freshman in NCAA being 20yo). And Songaila made NT being 22yo, while we speculate that 19yo Tubelis potentially might be in the camp this summer and maybe would even make it if he continues to develop big time.
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Honestly, I absolutely don't care about Pakenas or Urbonas analysis. They are weak at it. Even for me as amateurish bball fan, as you can hear lot of simply stupid things they are bringing out. They are questioning things and they has no answers why. Their strong part is inside info, at times they get some interesting things you didn't know, or Urbonas used to have decent interviews with interesting people, the rest I'm not interested anymore. If there's a guy who can bring some analysis, then there's Leksas in these podcasts things. The reason I made Songaila comparison was not only their playing styles or position they plays, but more like possible influence in NT. No that go-to guy, but important rotation player. That's where I see Tubelis now if he will live up to my expectations, pretty much like Songaila was in frontcourt.
That stats things, not really fair to judge. It has 20 years or so difference, it all changed too much. At least I don't take that into consideration, I'm not that stats or records geek too :)
 
Straight forward said:
Interesting shot. That's a good one. In 2015 we can also name Seibutis, Maciulis, Jankunas as well.

Other than that, I think say Sabonis, Marciulionis, Chomicius in 1992 (even though, now I would have to watch Chomicius closely again, he was on his decline). And surely Songaila, M.Zukauskas, Siskauskas in the golden season. Those provided modern and strong defensive punch, Sireika at that time already was very modern switching everything at times.
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Siskauskas,M.Zukauskas,Songaila i doubt played together alot.It didnt make no sense play them together they used sub each other.

3 best backourt defenders in Ltu history was Chomicius,Siskauskas,Seibutis.

Best defender of all time Siskauskas in my view that men was lithuanian Pippen for a reason .
 
Straight forward said:
It's simple. The younger you are as a prospect going to the drafts, the more credit you get. There's rather substantial difference even between 19 and 20. The same Jokubaitis talked about it.
Click to expand...

My point was that ncaa with those elite tallents at 20 and 21 was stronger overall back in a day when they still cared about getting education than with only 19 in ncaa elite tallents and they are gone after one year.

I understand why those super tallents going at 19 to nba.
 
Mindozas, maybe not exactly in the game against Lithuania, but that Russia kept red hot Spain with 59pts in the final. That's super incredible. I thought Kirilenko, Khriapa, Holden were in great shape. When you have 2 spiders like Kirilenko, Khriapa who with their agile and long libs can reach any spot of the court, this makes huge difference. IMO, that Russian team was more of defensive team and also played smart offense.

Yeah, I generally agree with Tubelis' role, it's just that I expect even more at both ends of the floor than Songaila had been providing.

Shawshank, Songaila played a little bit as center in that Eurobasket, could play even more, IMO. And you missed Marciulionis. To me he was defensively just as explosive as offensively. Specially his best years with Golden State. I think Maskoliunas' name as a good perimeter defenders also could be in consideration.
 
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