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Thread: Lithuanian NT 2017

  1. #921
    Senior Member LuDux's Avatar
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    Agreed, we should follow Serbian tactic: replace missing NBA players with EL starters

  2. #922
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    As long as you don't call foreign players, you're good.

  3. #923
    Senior Member Shawshank's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LuDux View Post
    Agreed, we should follow Serbian tactic: replace missing NBA players with EL starters
    you dont have nothing to say yourself ? only to attack other people messages? If yes so keep those remarks to yourself.Get a life,not remarking every comment i make here.

    Serbia is missing like 6-7 best players out of top 10 they have right now .Whats Djordjevic did is superb coaching .

  4. #924
    Senior Member Hepcat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Straight forward View Post
    I also got the impression that Hepcat didn't watch him playing this season.
    You're correct. I did not. But I also tend to withhold judgement on a player until he's done something, preferably good, for the national team.


  5. #925
    Senior Member Svajunas's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hepcat View Post
    You're correct. I did not. But I also tend to withhold judgement on a player until he's done something, preferably good, for the national team.

    Youre absolutetly right, however for us who followed him this season its kind of obvious that he is way above the other guards you mentioned. Some of us even think that he's is better then current Kalnietis.

  6. #926

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    It would be nice to send this thread back to Lith section or WC qualification, it's kinda depressing to have it here anyway

    Here's one of Lith BB portals prediction of the NT roster in upcoming WC qualification:

    PG: Juskevicius, Girdziunas
    SG: Seibutis, Grigonis, Gecevicius
    SF: Gailius, Giedraitis
    PF: Orelikas, Bendzius
    C: E.Kairys, K. Lavrinovic, M. Sajus

    Solid prediction, but I remember very well Adomaitis talked with Delininkaitis and I believe he is still better offensive player than both Juskevicius and Girdziunas. The problem is we don't have a single PG who can guard any-one. Maybe against second tier NT it will be enough, but it's an open hole in contemporary BB. Seibutis and Grigonis at 2 is a very nice and solid duet for such event.

    Gailius seems to be in a good shape at the moment, so I agree that he probably should start at 3. I would consider Sedekerskis here as well because I think he's already better defender than Giedraitis (IMO, no brainer) and maybe even a bot better than Gailius.

    Orelikas is a solid option, he can score at will against second tier opposition. Bendzius? Well hopefully it's correct decision as a short term option, but i would see much more sense integrating one of Sedekerskis/Ehodas here as I think all 3 are more or less at the same level already. But since Adomaitis warmed up Bendzius now he will use him inevitably (some-one who wouldn't be so concerned with short term result alone would make different move here, I'm pretty sure).

    Center position is crappy to be honest. Ok, Kristof is no-brainer still best option here, maybe Darjus is available as well? But we don't have a single stud which we could trust even for such competition. Both Kairys and Sajus are mediocre at best. If we at least could throw Gudaitis or Kavaliauskas, that would be solid. Now this position sucks, IMO.

    Overall I see a lot of scoring power in all positions except 5, but defensively this team would suck at EB level...hopefully it will be more than enough to qualify to WC,

    The flick from the future...

  7. #927

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    As a devoted NT fan I had to go back and watch Greece- Lithuania for one more time to realize what really happened, and here's my reflections:

    - From the very start we suffered because of crappy transition defence, D-Mo let Printezis to score at least 4 easy points in fast brakes (not only him sucked at this point, whole tournament problem). I have few reasons to explain why that kept happening in EB: we had 2 kinda slow bigs in the starting line-up and our turtle half court offence was so sticky and synthetic that we couldn't quickly and optimally gather for the defensive effort, Adomaitis simply couldn't establish well oiled team defence, something Kazlauskas was surely able to do.
    - Kalnietis was weak link from the very first minutes of the game, specially defensively, he was an open hole, hate to say this. Calathes was going through him all game long. Like it wouldn't be enough he shot the ball 4/12 from the field and 4 To's is not the all story. He made a least 3-4 bad passes when JV or other player touched the ball, but couldn't control it. To sup up, Kalnietis couldn't guard anyone, I think he was second worse defender after Gecevicius in the team and overall failed to deliver as a main PG.
    - JV's defence. After p'n'r he steps back to deep and allows Calathes to finish with a comfortable floater. Later he's too far away from Papagiannis who finishes with an open baby hook. JV usually is too distant from the guard, that comes from NBA off course (plenty off athletic guards who can punish him at the rim) and overall he doesn't have defensive flexibility to be a good p'n'r defender (not news though).
    - Kalnietis kept running p'n'r with JV almost every single possession. but very often Kalnietis just dumped the ball to a player standing in a bad position for a bad shot (that's a complain for the coach, you can't play such predictable O again and again).
    - Maciulis (offensively), Gudaitis and Specially Gecevicius choked (he did so many harm in 3 minutes that it's beyond any criticism).
    - Anytime Kuzminskas went to the basket aggressively good things happened, we had to play through him even more.
    -And as mentioned before, no guard except Girgonis could play D...

    To sum up, we barely can play Kalnietis and JV together. We build the team around them primarily and this decision was destructive, specially in the knock out stage where we usually were able to find more balance, to play more flexible, vital BB, but it didn't happen this time. We had to utilize our forwards as Kuzminskas and Ulanovas so much more, we had to look for transition options. Just as last summer Autralia's backourt went straight through our backourt, pretty much the same happened this year. In offence sometimes it works nicely, but both Kalnietis and JV are bad defenders. Kalnietis is washed out defensively generally and JV is just not good p'n'r defender. NT should radically reform the attitude at the current talent pool, Kalnietis is not starting calibre player of NT any more. After this tournament I have little doubt Lekavicius is a better player already, he would be because of his lock down perimeter defence alone, but I think he's already better offensively as well. At offence Kalnietis still is a decent player, but the way he played defensively is not excusable. His role should surely be reduced. We have to increase tempo, to build around agile and aggressive players as Kuzminskas, Sabonis, Lekavicius, Ulanovas, to link JV only with a good defensive PGs (we have one at he moment...). Kalnietis could come of the bench and to do what he does best - looking for his own shot in transition. If he would play 10-14 minutes he would have enough of stamina for that kind of BB, something what he currently does for Milano team. His facilitating ability is overrated, he usually ball hogs (his dribbling is really bad) and his assists and to's balance wasn't good in this tournament. Also Kalnietis should be linked with a good defensive bigs, let's say Jankunas and Sabonis, this way they can cover him defensively a little bit. Other than that I think this tournament was the beginning of the end of Kalnietis' era (2000-2016). His last 2 years poor club performances are no fluke...He had a miraculous offensive performance in OG, but that doesn't happen every summer and even than it wasn't the best thing for the team (he was looking for his own shot primarily). We should be heading forward, but I'm afraid Adomaitis doesn't have guts to do so, hopefully I'm wrong.

    The flick from the future...

  8. #928
    Senior Member Hepcat's Avatar
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    I think that Greek Coach Missas simply put together a game plan to take advantage of the Lithuanian team's weaknesses and the Greek players executed it to perfection.

    On defence, the Greeks knew that Mantas Kalnietis was the best playmaker that the Lithuanian team had, but that he was struggling to hit his threes (25% in the tournament). Meanwhile Adas Juškevičius who was Kalnietis' backup at PG was shooting out the lights from three point range (50% in the tournament) but his playmaking isn't necessarily that good. Therefore when Kalnietis was playing the Greeks did their very best to take away the passing lanes while letting Kalnietis shoot. He ended up hitting only one of six three pointers in the game. When Juškevičius was on the court, the Greeks did their best to take away his shot opportunities and challenged him to make plays. The Greeks defenced Martynas Gecevičius (50% from three point range in the tournament) the same way. Juškevičius ended up shooting only two three-pointers and missed them both while Gecevičius missed his sole attempt.

    On offence the Greeks knew their guards were quicker and more mobile than the Lithuanian guards. Therefore the Greeks opted to play from the perimeter where they could create space from the slow-footed Lithuanian guards and hopefully get open to make three-pointers. And they did making 11 of 24 in the game. They also attacked the Lithuanian team from the PF slot where Lithuania had only one natural PF, Donatas Motiejūnas, who'd lost mobility due to back problems and had been struggling for much of the tournament.

    Lithuanian Coach Adomaitis just had no answer to the Greeks' game plan which effectively exploited the Lithuanian team's weaknesses.

    Last edited by Hepcat; 09-22-2017 at 04:33 PM.

  9. #929

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    What you're saying is more or less true. While watching second time I was emphasizing guard's defence and I was so much surprised how bad Kalnietis' defence was and performance overall. Maybe he can still bounch back, maybe this summer he wasn't as good prepared physically, but I clearly see his time is coming to the end, if he continues to play like that. It's all about the match- ups and the reality is that Adomaitis didn't have better options (Juskevicius couldn't check neither Calathes or Sloukas and was missing everything...). He could try Ulanovas at 2 and to play Grigonis at 1, I wanted to see that, but that's about it. We should have a prime Shaq or Hakeem to win something with such non-existant perimeter defence and it would be still huge question. We simply can't afford to play Kalnietis when he's playing such D and more or less sucks at O. It's only one game, but his defence was at this level all tournament long more or less. If not Grigonis defence, he made a lot of nice defensive plays, it could be a sweep, at some point of the game it looked exactly like this. It's a must to have Lekavicius, Grigonis, Seibutis as 3 best guards defensively + to expect that some youngster will prevail (I really find hard to believe that some-one like Valinskas who has good legs is worse defender that Kalnietis, Milaknis). Kalnietis can only cover limited veteran's role, IMO. Unless he will change something, will improve his physical condition notably.

    The flick from the future...

  10. #930
    Senior Member Shawshank's Avatar
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    100 sentence and 95 about how bad Kalnietis is and how bad you want to see Lekavicius main pg When you rewatched a game did you see anybody else or only Kalnietis?



    Ok about game versus Greece.Sloukas killed us, who was guarding Sloukas in that game? Kalnietis? I dont think so, but its Mantas fault that Sloukas scored 20pts+?

    Other very importamt thing was our bench play.In group our bench played super well how they did when lights become brighter and pressure become bigger in playoffs? Its also Mantas fault, that some inexperience players was in panic mode and couldnt think? As coached said we did too many mental mistakes.

    Motiejunas, juskevicius, milaknis, gecevicius, gudaitis was minuses and only hurt us.But you see only Kalnietis bad play? Mantas had bad game, but those 5 were just pathetic...

    Maciulis, Grigonis and Ulanovas atleast played good defence and they can stay in playoofs games.Those 5 cant...Kalnietis wasnt the weakest spot in our defence but he was the only one who could run the team from that roster.

    In 2019 and 2020 Mantas will be 33-34 so yeah its old age for main pg and we can use his experience from the bench i see no problem here .But that we need such veteran experience that will not panic in pressure moments this playoffs shown once again.You cant have bench of youngters and rookies and dream they gonna show up in playoffs...every team needs atkeast 2-3 old foxes to help main players from the bench in tough moments.

  11. #931

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    Shawshank, even before the camp I said such as Gecevicius and Juskevicius (well and Milaknis, even if I expected more from him) are not NT material and I still think so. They both provided in the group stage, but ultimately group stage means little. Greece sucked in the group stage, but they had players who know and can contribute under pressure and they did.

    I talk about Kalnietis a lot because I think his impact was the key. We could survive D-Mo sucking, we could survive Gudaitis struggling, but we couldn't survive Kalnietis not delivering at both ends of the flour. Sure, we still need him this Olympic cycle, but most likely his role should be reduced, specially because of defence.

    Rookies not necessary sucks in the knock out stage, Ulanovas was a rookie, but he didn't shit his pants, he was actually really decent in that game and could be played more. JV was a rookie in 2011, but he gave us great performances in very important stretch of the tournament, against such teams as France, Serbia, Germany. I'm not even going deeper mentioning the ones like Siskauskas, Macijauskas. It's all about the talent and skill set. Even Lekavicius and Grigonis were useful as rookies and didn't blew it entirely.

    The flick from the future...

  12. #932
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    „Vasarą turėjome susitikimą su Seibučiu ir tai buvo jo noras nežaisti, nes turėjo sveikatos problemų ir norėjo jas susitvarkyti, – sakė specialistas. – Kalbėjome, kad šią vasarą jis skirts traumų išsigydymui. Žinoma, kad jo norėjau komandoje. Renaldas yra rinktinės startinio penketo žaidėjas. Jis ir Jankūnas yra geriausiai besiginantys komandos žaidėjai. Jis tikrai būtų buvęs komandoje, jei būtų galėjęs žaisti.“

    https://www.basketnews.lt/news-11342...inktineje.html

  13. #933
    Senior Member Shawshank's Avatar
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    So who guarding sloukas? Maybe Greece took advantage of Valanciunas/Gudaitis inability to guard pickenroll? You can have the best perimeter defender in the world, but if your center is really bad in pickenroll defence you will struggle stopping it in fiba game.Our coaching stuff have to have clear plan what to do with Jv and pickenroll defence, because we gonna be attacked by it over and over again.Last 3 years we were.Obviuosly we have to have him on the floor, but how minimaze the damage ,because everybody knows that Jonas is really bad at it.Sloukas who is very fast and really shoots well its nightmare matchup for Jonas in pickenroll defence.

    Yes its all about level.But we dont have that super players you mentione level neither in youngsters , neithers in old foxes.So which ones of them is more hope they gonna step up and give us good minutes in pressure moments and help main players in 2019 Wc?

    Im not saying that you you need to put old geezers team no , im saying that this 2017 was too inexperience team to win playoofs games.And when combine it with rookie coach you get what we got.Kazlauskas took more experienced teams, and he did really good with them.

    Before tournament 2 positions and 2 players couldnt play bad if we would had a chance for long playoof run.It was Kalnietis and Motiejunas.They were the only true options in their positions.One played not well ,other played just badly.

  14. #934
    Senior Member Hepcat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dreamcatcher View Post
    „Vasarą turėjome susitikimą su Seibučiu ir tai buvo jo noras nežaisti, nes turėjo sveikatos problemų ir norėjo jas susitvarkyti, – sakė specialistas. – Kalbėjome, kad šią vasarą jis skirts traumų išsigydymui. Žinoma, kad jo norėjau komandoje. Renaldas yra rinktinės startinio penketo žaidėjas. Jis ir Jankūnas yra geriausiai besiginantys komandos žaidėjai. Jis tikrai būtų buvęs komandoje, jei būtų galėjęs žaisti.“

    https://www.basketnews.lt/news-11342...inktineje.html
    So that statement by Coach Adomaitis implies that Seibutis chose to take the summer off to recover from nagging hurts.


  15. #935

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    LOL, what Adomaitis can say now? Openly say that it was basically his decision and that he threw the NT under the bus (because we got slaughtered exactly at position 2)? That's what he says now very much contradicts to what Seibutis said in the interview that I posted here. I would like an interview from Seibutis in the first place, but it doesn't matter now, too late, besides Seibutis is too humble to make a fuzz of it, specially that he probably will work with Adomaitis in the nearest future.

    Shawshank, Grigonis was checking Sloukas in the first half and he did a heck of a job, Sloukas probably didn't score a single point, but in the second half he forced Grigonis to pick up personal fouls and drained couple of shots through him. But the biggest problems started when Juskevicius was checking him, and he couldn't do that. He just dominated Juskevicius.

    JV obviously had 2 or 3 situations where his defence was absolutely imbecile (incorrect p'n'r D and inability to step out for covering Bourousis three), but that's about it. The problem was that we had only one aggressive guard Grigonis who was able to adjust after p'n'r nicely. Both Kalnietis and Juskevicius were more of a symbolic defensive figures. There's no doubt with Seibutis and Lekavicius we could shut their guards down much more effectively.

    But i also have to say all the team kinda didn't have the best game. Two many mistakes, too many missed rebounds, not enough of hustle and aggressiveness. We need sharper and hungrier players - no-brainer Sabonis and Lekavicius in the first place (you asked who) and off course veterans as Jankunas, Seibutis. And we more or less good to go (specially if some young SG will prevail till 2019).

    The flick from the future...

  16. #936
    Senior Member LuDux's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hepcat View Post
    So that statement by Coach Adomaitis implies that Seibutis chose to take the summer off to recover from nagging hurts.

    If you ignore some words and letters, he actually says that he doesn't like Seibutis

  17. #937
    Senior Member Hepcat's Avatar
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    Well Coach Adomaitis does say that the two best defenders from which Team Lietuva can draw are Renaldas Seibutis and Paulius Jankūnas.

    Interesting as well is that he reaffirmed that Team Lietuva would continue to refuse naturalized players for the indefinite future. His statement that only players who were developed by Lithuanian coaches in the Lithuanian system would be considered for the team also seems to imply that Team Lietuva would refuse to consider Americans or Canadians of ancestry even if they ended up playing in Lithuania and acquired Lithuanian citizenship. I'm wondering whether Adomaitis realized that he was making that strong a statement.


  18. #938

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    Lekavicius recovering nicely, a bit faster than expected! Expects to be ready for the first Euroleague's game. Here's long fresh interview. I liked this one the most:

    "Would they let me go to play in FIBA qualification games? I don't know, I didn't talk about it yet" D

    https://www.15min.lt/24sek/naujiena/...ine-874-858744

    Here is good analysis by Vysniauskas and Kunigelis - https://www.15min.lt/24sek/naujiena/...ja-875-854942:

    Agreed on most parts, specially that only defensive sharpness and concentration, mental issues separates Kuzminskas from being absolute beast in FIBA. Interesting that they see Ulanovas as starting SF. On other hand, can't agree with Vysniauskas that Lekavicius will remain a back-up of Kalnietis. His analogy - Kalnietis is no.1 in offence and Lekavicius is no.1 in Defence - is wrong because that's depreciation of Lekavicius offensive abilities (I don't see current Kalnietis launching 29pts in 21min in EL, or 16pts in 14min as against Latvia). IMO, Kunigelis was wiser saying he expects them both at Olympic team 2020. We shouldn't do the same mistake with Kalnietis and Maciulis as we did with Jasikevicius and Kaukenas in 2012 (not to mention that latter 2 were way superior as PROs). They couldn't carry NT any more and, IMO, Kalnietis and Pocius already were better than those, but we build the team around them (something similar happened in 2011). We shouldn't waste one or two tournaments just because of the respect for our leaders of the past.
    Last edited by Straight forward; 09-27-2017 at 12:49 AM.

    The flick from the future...

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