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  • Philippine Supremacy in Asian Basketball a Pipe Dream?

    Exercise in futility?
    By Joaquin M. Henson
    Thursday, November 8, 2007

    Philippine coach Luigi Trillo said playing in the demonstration sport of 3-on-3 basketball at the recent Asian Indoor Games in Macau was an eye-opener.

    Trillo couldn’t believe how skillful the Iranian, Chinese and Hong Kong giants were in claiming the top three spots in the eight-nation tournament where the age limit for players was 18.

    Big men are usually clumsy and can’t put the ball on the floor without fumbling. But not the 6-11, 6-10, 6-8, 6-6 and 6-5 players whom Trillo watched, almost in disbelief.

    It wasn’t a dream. Trillo was in awe as the Iranians, in particular, showed they’re in a class of their own in Asia.

    “I think Filipino players can compete with our Asian opponents on a skills basis but we just don’t have their size,” said Trillo who was a consultant in coach Fritz Gaston’s team that finished second in the SEABA women’s championships a few weeks ago. “That’s a problem we’ve got to address even in coach Franz’ (Pumaren) youth program. Looking for big Fil-Ams might help.”

    In the 3-on-3 tournament, the Philippines got off to an auspicious start, blasting Malaysia, 21-4, and Chinese-Taipei, 21-13. But against Iran, the Filipinos just couldn’t keep pace. From a 13-all tie, Iran held the Philippines without a point the rest of the way to win, 21-13. The loss dropped the Philippines into a playoff against Hong Kong for third spot.

    Trillo said all the players appeared to be within the age limit. The disparity was in physical growth.

    “I tried pick-and-rolls, back-picks, motion and kick-outs to get an advantage,” said Trillo. “But we were up against bigger guys who could move. No excuses. We lost to better teams but we fought hard ‘til the end.”

    Trillo noticed the Hong Kong players hung out with the Chinese and probably came from the Mainland.

    “I don’t know if Hong Kong has a basketball development program like ours but their players looked very polished,” said Trillo. “They opened a 5-0 lead against us but we came back to go ahead, 28-23. Then, they hit two triples in a row. We tried to catch up but fell short by two. I was disappointed with the officiating. I thought the officiating was fair when we lost to Iran but could be better when we lost to Hong Kong.”

    Iran wound up bagging the title, upsetting China in the finals.

    “I found out the Iranian coach has visited Manila thrice, twice as a player and once as a coach,” said Trillo. “He knows how Filipinos love the game. Iran doesn’t have too many leagues so players are able to get together for practice without too much difficulty unlike us. The team that won the Asian title in Tokushima recently had mostly junior players so you can imagine how strong Iran will be in the coming years.”

    SBP executive director Patrick Gregorio broached the idea to Trillo of coaching the Philippines in the next Asian Indoor Games in Vietnam two years from now and in the first Youth Olympics where 3-on-3 basketball will likely be calendared in 2010.

    “The 3-on-3 game is very different,” said Trillo. “You inbound from the baseline and if the receiver gets the ball from inside the lane, he has to bring it out beyond the three-point line before making a play. It’s a half-court game so you can’t run transition, meaning you can’t use the length of the floor for speed against size.”

    For Macau, Trillo enlisted 5-10 Clark Bautista, 6-2 Ryan Buenafe, 6-4 Nico Salva and 6-5 Arvie Bringas.

    The heartbreaking loss to Hong Kong left the boys limp in the dressing room, crying their eyes out. But Gregorio called on them to show up at the awarding ceremonies, never mind if they were reduced to mere spectators.

    “Pato (Gregorio) was a class act,” said Trillo. “He challenged us to get up and hold our heads high. We showed everyone our sense of sportsmanship.”

    The Filipinos’ spirit was so evident that at the end of the hostilities, Gregorio was invited by FIBA secretary-general Patrick Baumann to speak in behalf of the eight teams during the closing ceremonies. The honor had to be in recognition of the Philippines’ passion for the game, no matter the odds.

    But will the passion ever translate into a gold medal in 3-on-3? Is it an exercise in futility to try to form a competitive team for the next Asian Indoor Games? Are Filipinos doomed to failure in a half-court game where the Goliaths can easily overpower the Davids? Surely, hoping for honors in the 2010 Youth Olympics is wishful thinking.

    Should the Philippines instead concentrate on other sports or events where there is a reasonable probability of success?

  • #2
    pipe dream??? c'mon man we've been champions before so its not right to say its a pipe dream; well if you're trying to imply that the RP will be the "Dominant Asian BBall country in the Future" and that would be a pipe dream.
    you know why I am happy

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by pinoyballer
      Hong Kong giants

      the glasses guy (Lau Hoi Tao) is only 6-5.. "6-5 giants"... Filipinos are indeed short.

      Here's the thread about the tournament
      http://forums.interbasket.net/showthread.php?t=5257
      Last edited by sinobball; 11-07-2007, 07:11 PM.
      aim low, score high

      Comment


      • #4
        philippines should ask china the formula of their growth ginseng or vitamins. whatever they called it so that we can also grow taller than china. china and philippines are the same in terms of average height. there are just people in china who stand higher above the rest.
        "There are only three kinds of mathematicians: those who can count, and those who can not."

        Ana "The Hurricane" Julaton - 1st Filipino Female Boxer Double Word Champion.

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by sinobball

          the glasses guy (Lau Hoi Tao) is only 6-5.. "6-5 giants"... Filipinos are indeed short.

          Here's the thread about the tournament
          http://forums.interbasket.net/showthread.php?t=5257
          if the likes of:
          1. EJ Feihl - 7'0"
          2. Marlou Aquino - 6'9"
          3. Vincent San Diego - 6'9"
          4. Raul Dillo - 7'2"
          5. Eric Canlas - 6'9"
          6. Yancy de Ocampo - 6'9"
          7. Jericho de Guzman - 6'11"
          8. Japeth Aguilar - 6'9"
          9. Gian Chiu - 6'9"
          10. Greg Slaughter - 6'11"
          11. Bonel Balingit - 6'9"
          ... et al...
          are just trained early and can play like yao ming, wang zhizhi, menk bateer, yi jianlian. we can match up with china and the rest of the worlds. just imagine the height of those I listed above. that excludes the other players that I forgot who also stand within that height. so all in all, filipinos are not that short in height. they are short in exposure, funding, training and support from people and the government.
          "There are only three kinds of mathematicians: those who can count, and those who can not."

          Ana "The Hurricane" Julaton - 1st Filipino Female Boxer Double Word Champion.

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by ankle breaker
            if the likes of:
            1. EJ Feihl - 7'0"
            2. Marlou Aquino - 6'9"
            3. Vincent San Diego - 6'9"
            4. Raul Dillo - 7'2"
            5. Eric Canlas - 6'9"
            6. Yancy de Ocampo - 6'9"
            7. Jericho de Guzman - 6'11"
            8. Japeth Aguilar - 6'9"
            9. Gian Chiu - 6'9"
            10. Greg Slaughter - 6'11"
            11. Bonel Balingit - 6'9"
            ... et al...
            While I can easily find 30 7 foot BASKETBALL players in China who are under 30 years old, it seems that the number of relatively tall players in RP is about right, when you consider that China and Philippines probably have same average height and China's population is 15 times higher.

            So the problem lies in training those athletes. China has a rigorous national program which identifies these tall kids and send them to sports schools early on. RP, on the other hand has the American model which is to let players play by themselves and invite them to NT. This is a very different approach and it results in the best players are short. It doesnt fly internationally though as non-Asians are much taller.
            aim low, score high

            Comment


            • #7
              sinoball,

              this is a very interesting comment. I agree with it completely. The grassroots devt of our players specially the tall young players is still way behind. Thank you !!!

              Originally posted by sinobball
              While I can easily find 30 7 foot BASKETBALL players in China who are under 30 years old, it seems that the number of relatively tall players in RP is about right, when you consider that China and Philippines probably have same average height and China's population is 15 times higher.

              So the problem lies in training those athletes. China has a rigorous national program which identifies these tall kids and send them to sports schools early on. RP, on the other hand has the American model which is to let players play by themselves and invite them to NT. This is a very different approach and it results in the best players are short. It doesnt fly internationally though as non-Asians are much taller.
              Last edited by pachador; 11-07-2007, 08:51 PM.
              =========================================
              Anyone who wants to replace a coach because his dwarf team keeps losing against bigger teams is wishing for a miracle and should get a magician. A more practical solution is to get reinforcements unless one is content to wait a few more years in the hope that the dwarf players will grow wings and fly over their defenders. PBA reinforcements will not guarantee a championship, but it will guarantee close losses which is enough to make me happy.

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by b3lowzro
                pipe dream??? c'mon man we've been champions before so its not right to say its a pipe dream; well if you're trying to imply that the RP will be the "Dominant Asian BBall country in the Future" and that would be a pipe dream.
                Anyone who doesn't recognize that Philippine supremacy in Asian basketball is a pipe dream is in denial. Even SBP officials recognize this. Filipinos shouldn't think that the 1960s could come back.

                In the last FIBA Asia, even if the Philippines qualified for the next round, I don't believe it would have landed in the semis. Fifth place at the most, and this when China didn't even send a decent team.

                Unless, of course, the Philippines would naturalize a 6-8 to 7-0 "rebounding devil" and hire a decent foreign coach.

                I agree with everyone who says there's lack of training and grassroots development. But that is a minor problem. The bigger problem is lack of height. Up to the 1960s, RP was dominant because it was the only basketball-crazy country in Asia. Even with Jaworski at 6-0 playing G/F/C, and Loyzaga at 6-4 at C, RP dominated. In the 70s, Paner at 6-2 and Guidaben at 6-5 were centers. In those days, a basketball analyst commented that 6-2 to 6-4 was the optimum Asian height for basketball, and that was true. The great Shin-Dong Pa and Adornado, both 6-2, were the best examples.

                Today, I think the best height for Filipinos and other Asians to retain basketball athleticism is about 6-6. There may be 6-7 to 6-11 Filipinos, but at these heights, they lost athleticism and mobility to be a skilled C/F. I don't believe that there are any available today or even in the next few years.

                As well, as I've said before, future Asian basketball dominance will not come from SE Asia, not even from China and Korea, but from the Middle East. Those SBP officials saw reality in Macau, where Iran dominated.

                It's a pipe dream.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by pinoyballer
                  Today, I think the best height for Filipinos and other Asians to retain basketball athleticism is about 6-6. There may be 6-7 to 6-11 Filipinos, but at these heights, they lost athleticism and mobility to be a skilled C/F. I don't believe that there are any available today or even in the next few years.

                  As well, as I've said before, future Asian basketball dominance will not come from SE Asia, not even from China and Korea, but from the Middle East. Those SBP officials saw reality in Macau, where Iran dominated.

                  It's a pipe dream.
                  The truth really hurts, you are absolutely correct dude. If there's a 6-7 and taller filipino, don't expect to find skills, agility and mobility on them. Even training and development, long term might it be would be disappointment I guess, just like what I stated in another thread.....

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    whoooow! IRAN THE NEXT POWERHOUSE OF ASIA?!

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by onono1
                      The truth really hurts, you are absolutely correct dude. If there's a 6-7 and taller filipino, don't expect to find skills, agility and mobility on them. Even training and development, long term might it be would be disappointment I guess, just like what I stated in another thread.....
                      Sad but true. The Philippines need to have some kind of national program that will develop skills, weight training, endurance, especially diet etc at a young age all the way to manhood. The opportunity must exist in this kind of program and it must be open to all kids, no matter if you're poor or rich.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        true

                        Originally posted by b3lowzro
                        pipe dream??? c'mon man we've been champions before so its not right to say its a pipe dream; well if you're trying to imply that the RP will be the "Dominant Asian BBall country in the Future" and that would be a pipe dream.

                        im in macau right now and my chinese friends taunts me that as long as china is there. theres no way the philippines will become asias basketball champion again. they said it right in my goddamn face.


                        They promised me NEVER.


                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Same

                          Originally posted by armorpiercing
                          im in macau right now and my chinese friends taunts me that as long as china is there. theres no way the philippines will become asias basketball champion again. they said it right in my goddamn face.


                          They promised me NEVER.


                          Here in New Zealand... Filipino themselves shove it in my face... that RP doesn't have a chance against China...

                          But as a Filipino... we'll just have to always think positive and the never-say-die attitude will always be there...

                          sigpic

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            guys lets include Jay Washington nd Joe De Vance in the RP Team they both played multiple position.. what do you think?
                            [http://basketball.powerplaymanager.c...a=201410504468

                            “Ang hirap kasi sa kanya, kapit tuko siya sa pwesto niya. Hangga’t pupuwede ayaw niyang bumitaw. Dapat dyan automatic yan nagre-resign siya, bigyan ng chance ang iba." -Abe King

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                            • #15
                              All I can say, is that you don't have to excel in basketball at a very high level to love the sport.

                              Indiana in the US, for example, are absolutely crazy about the sport, but they don't always end up winning a lot national championships, at least not lately, in the NCAA, or in the NBA (not that I know of, anyway, granting that I have limited knowledge about the US NCAA).

                              As for Pinoys, so what if Asian supremacy is a pipe dream? Basketball is a beautiful sport, & there's no stopping us from loving it as a sport even if other tall countries have already surpassed us in it.

                              Love the game for what it is, not just because we excel in it.
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